Transcript: September Q&A: Postpartum Anxiety and Depression – The Dark Secret No One Warned You About

This is a text transcript from The First Time Mum’s Chat podcast. The episode is called September Q&A: Postpartum Anxiety and Depression – The Dark Secret No One Warned You About and you can click on the link to view the full episode page, listen to the episode and view the show notes.

Helen Thompson: Hey mums, welcome to a very special episode of First Time Mum’s Chat. Are you struggling to keep your head above water after giving birth? Feeling like you’re the only one who can’t get it together? Well, you’re not alone and it’s time to get real about postpartum anxiety and depression.

In today’s Q& A episode, I’m diving into the raw and often hidden realities of what it’s really like to face these challenges head on and I’m sharing exclusive insight from experts and real mums who’ve been through it all. What are the warning signs you should never ignore? How can you tell if it’s just the baby blues or something more? You’re going to get answers to all these burning questions and more, straight from the experiences of those who’ve walked this road before you.

This isn’t just another episode, it’s a lifeline for every new mum feeling lost, overwhelmed or simply exhausted from pretending everything’s okay. I’ve taken some of the questions you’ve been asking me and I’ve found content from earlier episodes that address them. So during this episode you’ll hear excerpts of guests from their interview. I’ve included links to each of the episodes mentioned in the show notes.

So grab a cup of tea, take a deep breath and get ready to uncover the truth behind postpartum anxiety and depression. Trust me, you don’t want to miss this.

Before I get started, I wanted to reiterate that reoccurring theme here, which I feel is a big takeaway for all mums commencing their parenting journey, is the importance of being honest with yourself and others and not being afraid to admit when it comes too much and you need help, accepting that you’re human and not perfect. It is a very important step.

Being overwhelmed is not unusual, so take a big deep breath, relax and enjoy listening to what other mums have to say.

One of the mums I chatted with on this topic was Jenna. She shared her challenging time when she was coping with anxiety and she explains what worked for her. I asked her, you know that there is a light at the end of the tunnel, but you probably don’t see that light because you’re so, so stressed. What tip would you give to a mum going through anxiety and overwhelm?

Jenna Hodge: We’ve had, unfortunately, our fair share of stomach bugs. Not nearly as bad, but when they happened, it brought me back to that moment and I had to remind myself, okay, that ended, this is going to end, this sucks right now, this sucks even maybe today, this might suck tomorrow but the good thing is these things usually don’t typically last that long.

I just have to accept today for what it is and just kind of take one day at a time. The thing that I don’t like about those kinds of illnesses is they’re very contagious. So I just go into a protective mode of I’m going to make sure I do everything in my power. That this person is the only one who gets sick and no one else gets it.

I’m kind of on guard and prepared for, okay, tonight somebody else could wake up with it. Or I could get it cause I’m all in it. So I’m just kind of prepared ahead of time and not the best mindset to have. I’m more of a, I’m going to prepare for the worst because then if it doesn’t happen, then it’s good news.

Which is not necessarily a good thing to have. I wasn’t like down in the dumps, but I just give myself a moment when it happens. Like, oh, this sucks. All right, now what am I going to do about it? And I just make a plan and move on because dwelling in this sucks. Like I said, the moment is what it is. You can’t change that.

All you can change is how you respond to it. Your kids being sick, regardless of what it is, is not fun. Or you being sick is not fun. But it’s a time to like, OK, I’m going to stop trying to make all these things perfect and make all these things happen today, because I know today is not a normal day. And I’m going to accept that and let those things go for today.

Especially if you struggle with anxiety like me, or you’re super type A type of person, you like to plan, you like to be productive. And if your day just doesn’t go the way you want it to, because of something like this, and there’s always going to be something, it may not be an illness, but something will come up, especially when you’re a mom that you’re not expecting, that you may not have control over, and you just have to be prepared for those moments.

So as long as you have a good system in place on the good days, on the regular On the majority of the days, because the majority typically are not these kind of moments. Then when those things happen, you’re prepared. You’re not caught off guard. Also just realizing, hey, no one’s exempt from this. No one is an exception to these things.

We’re all human. And unless this happened, cancellations happen, disappointments happen, plans change. That’s life. You can’t walk around thinking you’re invincible from things happening. But you also don’t want to live every day doom and gloom or scared of the what ifs. Because then you’re just gonna get yourself into emotional rut and it’s gonna carry out into your kids and who you come across if you’re just aware, okay, here’s the possibilities, I hope they don’t happen right now or in the near future, so I’m just gonna live today for today and make plans for the best, knowing that if something happens to change those plans, it’s not gonna wreck my world.

Helen Thompson: Another guest I spoke with was Suzanne Yatim Aslam, a mum who struggled big time with postpartum depression. This led to her writing a book called Postpardon Me: a fickle woman’s spiral into postpartum depression and anxiety and how the hell she found her way out of it about her own experience of postpartum depression.

I asked her, what did you learn from when you went through postpartum anxiety and depression and what tools would you recommend to a mum who is going through it now?

Suzanne Yatim Aslam: So first of all, we have to identify it. We have to know there’s a problem. So I would tell a mom if it’s been over two to three weeks and you still feel the way you just did postpartum and you’re crying all the time and your body’s still aching and you’re really, really miserable and you’re feeling anxious and you’re feeling depressed and all of those things, and it’s still going there might be something we need to identify. So first we need to identify it. And if that means talking to your doctor, seeing a therapist, I think those are really great things. Here in the States they give you a questionnaire. I think, it’s maybe six weeks, you take the baby to the pediatrician, and then they give you this paper that you fill out that sort of asks you how you’re doing on a scale of one to blah, blah, blah.

And the questions are geared towards, are you going to hurt yourself or the baby? And so I checked no, because I had no plans on hurting myself or the baby, but so that nobody paid attention to me after that, because nobody was in any physical danger, so nobody offered any help. And in hindsight, at the time I filled it out and I thought nothing of it.

And then in hindsight, I was thinking this test needs to be corrected. We need to ask deeper question. So it’s either you’re perfectly fine or you’re suicidal. What about the whole spectrum in the middle of moms who were just drowning and need help?

Helen Thompson: Allison Lieberman, a mum of two and a family therapist postpartum anxiety expert, had more to add in an episode called How to Help with Postpartum Depression and Baby Blues After Pregnancy. As I’ve mentioned before, this is not a new fad thing. It is real and daunting, it happens to us all. She is passionate about helping new mums overcome anxiety by developing their confidence and shedding the mum guilt and building a community.

I asked her a question that has been on my mind. What exactly is baby blues? People always talk about baby blues, but from your perspective, what actually is baby blues?

Allison Lieberman: So I will define it, but I’ll also give my own personal example with baby blues, because I definitely remember having them. And so it’s typically within the first couple of weeks after giving birth. It definitely does not extend past three weeks. I think three weeks is kind of long. It’s usually the first two.

And it’s really just the overwhelming sense of overwhelm, sadness, tearfulness, crying for no reason, not sure what you’re doing, feeling like a failure, all of those things, but then it subsides, and it usually can be related to the adjustment, especially if you haven’t had children before, adjusting to bringing home a baby, but if you do have other children, adjusting to the new demands.

It’s also a chemical piece too, right? When we are pregnant, our bodies take 10 months to build up these hormones to get ready for childbirth and those hormones drop off in about three days after you give birth. So it’s quite a drastic shift and so that kind of contributes to the baby blues too. Not everybody experiences them, but most women do.

For me, I remember we were having friends come over for dinner. They were bringing dinner over. At least in the US, that’s the customary thing. You offer to bring dinner over and meet the baby and I walked out of my bathroom and I closed the door behind me and my dog was in there. He was in there for maybe 30 seconds and barked.

So it was not a bad thing but I could not stop crying and I was like, he’s going to think I hate him. I locked him in the bathroom and our friends came over and they were like, what is happening? And I was like, I can’t stop crying. I don’t know why. And it was very much just like overwhelming feeling that I couldn’t move past.

But when I look at it now, even the next day, I can’t believe I was that upset about that, but it was very upsetting at the time and so those are just sort of those reactions during that baby blues time. Once they subside, you might still have some of those things once in a while, but it shouldn’t be an everyday thing. If it is, you’ve sort of moved into some postpartum mental health stuff.

Helen Thompson: I spoke to Dr. Guarnotta in a podcast episode titled Returning to work after maternity leave, the intense mental challenges.

The mental challenges of returning to work after maternity leave is not easy for any mum. A lot of mums face anxiety when going back to work. Dr. Emily Guarnotta is a licensed clinical psychologist who specializes in treating maternal mental health conditions like postpartum depression and maternal mental health.

She understands the challenges that motherhood can bring and is passionate about supporting parents through every step of their journey. In my own experience as a childcare educator, I have observed how this is for a mother. They are stressed, which also makes the child stressed. So their anxiety is even worse. I spoke to Dr. Guarnotta in a podcast episode recently, and I asked her, what sort of advice would you give to a mum who is going through that trauma and doesn’t have the support from their colleagues?

Dr. Emily Guarnotta: The number one thing that I always tell moms when they’re preparing to go back to work is to understand that it is going to be a transition. So to have really realistic expectations for themselves, I tell them, don’t expect to go back the first day and feel like yourself and don’t push yourself too hard, too fast.

Give yourself time. to acclimate back and even if you’re feeling that pressure from your boss or your colleagues, you need to take a step back and tell yourself, I’m going to take this time because I know I’ve been through a lot. And to put that into place for themselves, even if they’re getting that pressure from other people.

I also think it’s very important to know your legal rights wherever you live. So here in the U S we have state laws around requiring mothers who are breastfeeding to have time to pump at work and just really educate yourself on what your rights are. So if your company is giving you a hard time about that, you know, legally what you’re entitled to.

Helen Thompson: Breastfeeding can be stressful for mums and in an episode titled How Can Breastfeeding Enhance or Protect a Mum’s Health After Giving Birth, I chatted with author Kelly Durbin about how can breastfeeding enhance or protect a mum’s health after giving birth. Kelly is an International Board Certified lactation Consultant, Childbirth Educator, Author and has a wide range of knowledge on this topic. Breastfeeding can be challenging for some mums and breastfeeding problems can lead to anxiety when your baby arrives.

So I asked Kelly this question, which has been on my mind for a very long time and I wanted to share this with you. How can breastfeeding enhance or protect the mother’s health in the short term, immediately after birth of their baby?

Kelly Durbin: That’s a great question. So immediately after the birth, the placenta is delivered after the baby is delivered, and that leaves a pretty large wound inside the uterine wall and because The uterus can and does often bleed after birth, it’s imperative that the uterus begins to shrink and clamp down on the blood vessels in the space where the placenta detached from the uterine wall.

The way that mother nature facilitates this is by breastfeeding, because when the baby is latched right after birth, breastfeeding causes uterine contractions, and the entire purpose of this is to send the message to the uterus to shrink the uterus down, and that allows those blood vessels to clamp down and to shrink so that blood isn’t flowing very excessively, or it’s not freely flowing from the site where the placenta was attached.

So in that way, breastfeeding immediately after birth, and by that I mean within the first 60 to 90 minutes, that helps the uterine wall to shrink. The uterus will eventually go back to its regular pre pregnancy size and those blood vessels become smaller and smaller so that they cannot bleed freely, which leads to a dramatic decrease in the risk of postpartum hemorrhage and that is a life saving measure for maternal health.

Helen Thompson: Not only did Lisa Quinney suffer from postnatal depression with her second child, but she was miles away from her family and friends who were in Germany. She is now an advocate for mothers suffering from postnatal depression.

I asked what are the signs that you had that could give insight to other mums.

Lisa Quinney: I think there are two ways of looking at that. So one is the signs that you feel yourself, that mums might want to know, like, how can I assess myself and reflect on how I’m feeling to maybe identify if there’s something not quite right. Then there’s the other perspective of what can health professionals do, GPs, what are they spotting, what can they ask for?

I know they have the screening tools, but to be completely honest with you if there’s no trust with the woman they are seeing, the screening tools are completely useless. I know this is a big statement, but honestly, I filled them out, but I didn’t trust anyone at the time because I felt so judged and so scared of what they might do or say about my parenting and how I was going.

I didn’t feel like it was safe to truthfully answer those questions. So there’s no trust. So for the moms. If you feel like you’re struggling to get through the day, if you are teary often, you just don’t feel like yourself anymore. If you don’t enjoy parental, like you thought you would, the first few days are really tough to adjust and it doesn’t matter if it’s your first baby or second or third baby, it’s always different and it’s always challenging. And then also the lack of sleep. So if you notice, for example, that even when the baby’s sleeping, you can’t go to sleep because you’re ruminating, have lots of thoughts. Maybe you keep listening to the baby and you just can’t seem to settle or rest.

That’s a sign that I think would be a good idea to get some help to talk to someone. If you feel like you’re fighting a lot with your spouse, if there’s a lot of conflict in the relationship, if you feel like, you know, More irritable than usual. I’m not just talking about the baby blues for the first week or so is always going to be really difficult adjusting with all the hormones and the drop in hormones and so on.

But if it’s longer than two weeks that you feel that way, it’s time to talk to someone and seek some help.

Helen Thompson: Thank you for joining me on this Q& A episode of First Time Mum’s Chat. I hope these shared experiences, expert insights, and heartfelt advice have brought you some comfort and clarity as you navigate the challenges of postpartum anxiety and depression. Remember, it’s okay to ask for help, to have tough days, and to lean on others when things feel overwhelming.

You’re not alone in this journey and there’s a community of support waiting for you. As you take each day one step at a time know that it’s perfectly normal to feel the way you do and there are resources and people ready to help you through.

I’ve included links to the full episodes, so you can dive deeper into any topic that resonates with you.

If you’ve enjoyed this episode, please consider subscribing, leaving a review. and sharing with other mums who might benefit from this conversation and if you have more questions or topics you’d like me to cover, don’t hesitate to reach out. I’d love to hear from you.

Got a burning question that you want to ask? Go to MyBabyMassage.net/message and send it to me. It only takes a moment. That’s MyBabyMassage.net/message. In the next episode, I’ll be doing another Q& A around baby massage which is so dear to my heart, covering many of the questions I’m regularly asked about. Until next time, take care of yourself mums, be gentle with your journey, and remember you’re doing an amazing job.